How Do You Do It?

[Sage]

I found a link for some pagan groups out here. I sent in an email, because it's invite only.

Not too sure I like that.

Also, they said on their website that I would have to declare what my faith practice is, and how long as well as recovery experiance, and that they would need a pagan reference.

Honestly, if they really ask for all that stuff, I will not go. Seems like a social click, and very exclusionary. Plus, I am not going to subject my friends nor myself to seeking approval for recovery. Why would these things be necessary?



Do you do that stuff?



Also, they say they start off the meeting by lighting candles in the directions and setting a simple altar. While pretty, I don't think all that is necessary. What do you think? Pagans differ so much in how things are done...and it's a meeting, not a ritual. They even stress that. But if it is not a ritual, why do all the ceremonial stuff?



What is your experiance in pagan meetings? How are they set up?

[foxyowl]

I am going to post that monday, I have just been busy.



If the group you sent an email to is DJs Spiral Steps, run, run quickly away.  She is not a happy woman.  There are others here that will agree with me.  I know she holds her meetings 'in secret' because her meeting moderators must be 'trained' and became rather furious when I politely asked her about them while forming my own meeting.  She completely took my inventory based on three email postings.  I wonder if she really has any meetings anyway.  And I just don't think many people submit to her interview process just to go to her secret meetings.  I just don't see pagans doing that.



Otherwise, I don't really understand why the group you contacted would need references, but give it a try, be open-minded, while knowing in the back of your mind they might be controlling.  Listen to your spidey sense. But you also live in the Bible Belt, and these people might have had some real problems in the past and have found it necessary to do this.  Or it might be in someone's home, which of course would need extra precuations. Why don't you ask them?  If they are legit, I'm sure they would be happy to tell you.  But I would recommend giving it a chance, there's just not that many pagan in recovery meetings and you could be blessed by having this one close to you.



Uh, I have an altar at EoR.  Everyone loves it, it is generic, just to the Elements, and it has grown over the months, people 'donate' to it, as well as bring their objects to it for the duration of the meeting.  We have a token of JP, our member who commited suicide on it.  It is something that is really a part of the meeting.  A pagan meeting.  And it is beautiful, living, constantly evolving presence, and I find comfort gazing at it.  And EoR is a 12-step meeting, and we get Wiccans, Asatru and other Heathens, COG, CUUPS, non-affliated, Buddhists, etc.  Who are addicted to alcohol, crystal meth, pot, pills, coke, etc.  Who go to AA, NA, CMA, CA, etc.



So I suppose if a whole group of people objected and it was group conscious, I would remove it. But an single person or two would have to accept it, or I would offer to help them form a new meeting, if that's what they wanted.  I would like to think that the health and happiness that they would find in EoR would supersede any objections people would have once they experienced it.

[Sage]

First off, yup, it is the Dj Spiral Steps. I was trying to have an open mind around it, but you pretty much said that what my gut was worried about.

I joined the message board, but then got this big long list of rules that pretty much said I am not allowed to say anything. Well, not really anything. But there are so many rules I am, quite frankly, afraid to speak. I thought...well, if I could sit and read stories that would be great. I use that, I need that. But no one else posts either lol



As to the altar, I could see it if it was mulit-religious. That makes sense. It sounded to me that they were planning on all but calling a circle. But I see your point, just had to broaden my view.



And, after reading Dena's post, I could see it by invite only if held in a persons home. I didn't consider that...because in my little world it wouldn't happen like that.



The whole thing pushed a button in me. I was offered an opportunity to set one up, but I think if I do that I would do it on my own. But that is still further down the line. I am not drinking, but most certainly not having an easy time of it by any means.



And no, I don't live in the bible belt. I live in the bay area CA, very open here. LOL My van is littered with pagan bumper stickers. I'm pretty much 'out' of the broom closet.

[Lyon]

I was invited to join DJ's group and did post several times. I was reprimanded on each occasion, so I decided that it wasn't for me. There are plenty of other forums where I can share my strength, experience and hope and not have to worry about breaking rules.



The Founding Fathers of AA talk about rules. Aside from AA's 12 tradtions there are none. Early in the Program's history they tried to have all sorts of rules, it didn't work. In fact, I wish I could remember where it was written, but they decided AGAINST rules.



I run my board with the AA principles in mind. Anything that needs to be decided is done in a group conscience or in a "busniess meeting" with the moderators.



As addicts/alcoholics we have spent our entire lives bucking the rules. When it comes to recovery we need all the hlep we can get to "get it" and that means avoiding long lists of rules.



 :razz:

[Sage]

I agree....rules. Bah humbug lol Too many rules send me running. Or send me rebelling, which ever the case may be.

[FilmGal]

Turn around and walk away from this meeting, and don't look back. 12 step groups are suppose to be "governed" by the group conscience, the 12 traditions and the 12 steps. Anything which supersedes these is a clear violation of the 12 traditions, and a definite indicator of spiritual problems within the group. (As well as the need for the meeting's ruling cartel to attend Al-Anon meetings.)



I know this firsthand from the pagan A.A. meeting I used to attend, the one I was eventually kicked out of (along with several other people). To quote the Bible (sorry, it's the only good reference I can think of to illustrate this point) - you can't serve two masters, you will love one and hate the other. You can't be a pseudo-coven and an A.A. meeting at the same time. You are an A.A. meeting first and foremost.



The problems with the pre-12 traditions rules is discussed in the 12 & 12 - Bill W. commented that if all the rules were in effect in all meetings at the same time, no one could possibly have been a member of A.A. - the sum of these rules would have excluded everyone.  



For the Pagans in Recovery group on MySpace, the requirement is that 1.) you're a 12 step recovery program and 2. you're a Pagan (although I've let in a few non-pagans I know). I don't really care what path they follow, which deities they honor, what drugs they've done, etc. It's suppose to offer a safe place for pagans to discuss issues concerning their recovery that they wouldn't ordinarily be able to discuss at A.A. meetings.  



Jessica

[Sage]

Jessica, I just (as in, just today, a few hours ago) discoved myspace. I have a name now, so how do I find pagans in recovery?

[FilmGal]

Here's the URL for the group:



http://groups.myspace.com/pagansinrecovery



It'll take you directly to the group.

:-D



Jessica

[Sage]

thanks I requested to join  

[Alethia]

I am new here, and  already like it! I was briefly involved in the Spiral Steps message board, posted a few times, but then, because each post has to be okay-ed, I found that I was sending the posts but they were not being posted. Granted they were on the angry side, but why am I not allowed anger? I wasn't directing it at anyone in the group but at myself and my own life, venting and getting to the bottom of some things I was going through at that time.

 I too found the rules a little hard to work around, I don't want to have to censor myself, I've been doing that all my life!

Anyway, I'm just glad to hear that others were not exactly comfortable with that format and am glad to have the chance to communicate with the group not just talk to myself. :?



Thanks again

J.

[foxyowl]

Lyon and I have both had run-ins with DJ of the Spiral Steps.  She is a very controlling woman.  You say she didn't like yours because yours were angry, hey she didn't like mine because they were happy and positive! Perhaps the only postings she does like are her own. She would PM me after each and every one, critizing my content (supposedly on a board that was open sharing) and totally taking my inventory, after just two postings, she told me several of my 'character defects' and how much it was obvious I disliked women!



Now I suspect in that exchange *one* of us didn't like other women, but I don't think it was me.  :lol:



So welcome to PiR, where we don't take ourselves so seriously, just our recovery!  

[gmmelendez]

Is anyone interested in starting PIR Meeting, Central Fla. Daytona Beach area? I guess we could meet outdoors in a park or something until we can get situated.

[Shadowdruid]

Just out of curiosity.... do we have a presence on Facebook as well? I am on FB a LOT more than on Myspace. Thanks in advance.

Shadow

Here's the URL for the group:



http://groups.myspace.com/pagansinrecovery



It'll take you directly to the group.

:-D



Jessica

[dakota]

the only requirement for aa is the desire to stop drinking.  the 12 traditions are the rules designed to keep us without rules i think. i concentrated more on the steps to stay sober.  learning the traditions more slowly.  anyways i think the most important rule is just having the desire to stop using anything.  if a place is uncomfortable don't go there.